[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by Severian

MUSIC is mathematical, quantifiable, yes. Music theory, no. It becomes an inherently non-objective, non-empirical method of research when things like testimonial evidence are used to support theses. Empiricism involves objective observation. Interviews and sound bytes and opinions from writers and musicians are not part of the equation.

Yeah, music is hella mathematical, and thereby scientifically applicable. Sure. But opinions are inherently subjective.



Yeah, right. Ok. Still talking about notes, math, data points. None of this is true of testimony. That's why the burden of "proof" is really just a burden of being convincing in law. You still have to default to the decision of a jury, who may not have listened to a damn word of the trial either way. It's not science, it's humanities and rhetoric.




Then musicologists would be linguists. Which they are to some degree, and I suppose the effect of sound on neural activity could be used to turn this into a question of science. Linguistics is a field that utilizes cognitive neuroscience (wut!) to legitimize itself scientifically. But linguistic theory is HELLA complex, and way beyond what any of us are talking about here. If music theorists wanted to adopt the research methods of psycholinguists, then we'd have some shit to talk about.



yep.



You don't have to explain the model to me man, I'm a neuropsych grad school dropout!!!




I still think you have yourself a working thesis at best. Find a way to test and measure it blindly, and replicate the results with diverse populations, and we'll be on the same page.


This is SHIT man you just HATE THE BEATLES! Admit it!!

Talking to you is fun.

that is the entire point. Once we have the math of identical chord progressions or timing or whatever now we have Exhibit A. Then we are not asking for opinions, we check and see firstly if the artists credkt their influences directly. If not THEN we are being subjective and making opinionated inferences but even then because there is underlying math to shape our assertions we at the least say it is a good estimation.
Also i think you stumbled onto something good with the linguists. They indeed have a very complex field but their task is to trace the evolution of language over time and the relationships between languages. Perhaps their methodologies can help us do the same kinds of classifications for different musics?


I don't need to research the origin of reggae Bob Marley, Alton Ellis, Johnny Clark, all these brothers all already said they were influenced by early Rock and Roll bands and the chord progressions are identical.