[wellcharge]

Originally Posted by ni'k

it's sad that people believe in the cultural hegemony of SHIT like fg enough to assume noone would read or explore literature on their own if it wasn't referenced by seth mcfarlane.

yeah, no kidding. Maybe an obscure author or something but who the fuck hasn't heard of dosto at least a few times

[SpectralJulianIsNotDead]

Originally Posted by ni'k

it's sad that people believe in the cultural hegemony of SHIT like fg enough to assume noone would read or explore literature on their own if it wasn't referenced by seth mcfarlane.

I personally got into Dostoyevsky because I was assigned to read Crime and Punishment in high school, and I really loved it so I picked up a few of his other novels.

I don't really think anyone saw Family Guy read Dostoyevsky because he was mentioned. That's just silly. And if someone wanted to, why not? Why decide not to read him because you heard about him first on Family Guy? You'd be completely cutting yourself off from a great novelist for a rather silly reason.

Family Guy is sort of a sickening reflection of our culture, in which we all sort of become nothing more but a shoddily put together collection of references, allusions, and memes. (At the end of Notes from the Underground, I think the Underground Man hints at this himself- saying that men engrossed in literature can't be real men, but just literary characters.)

[jon boy]

he's one of my favourite writers! i have read a few of his books and crime and punishment is still my favourite, next i would go to notes from the underground.

[ni'k]

Originally Posted by SpectralJulianIsNotDead

I personally got into Dostoyevsky because I was assigned to read Crime and Punishment in high school, and I really loved it so I picked up a few of his other novels.

I don't really think anyone saw Family Guy read Dostoyevsky because he was mentioned. That's just silly. And if someone wanted to, why not? Why decide not to read him because you heard about him first on Family Guy? You'd be completely cutting yourself off from a great novelist for a rather silly reason.

Family Guy is sort of a sickening reflection of our culture, in which we all sort of become nothing more but a shoddily put together collection of references, allusions, and memes. (At the end of Notes from the Underground, I think the Underground Man hints at this himself- saying that men engrossed in literature can't be real men, but just literary characters.)

i agree with you,i think the point i was trying to stress but obviously failed at was that i hate how because of family guys layers of "references/allusions/memes" it appears to the unwitting viewer to have attained some level of pomo detachment that renders it superior in a way that the sum total of its references suggest but crucially does not achieve. so the viewer thinks "i don't need to read crime and punishment, i don't need to pay attention to anything, just compile references and i can sail thru life on my fat stupid ass smugly above anyone who tries to do anything. im not saying that that doesn't apply to me either - i sadly remember a time when it was very difficult to even read or pay attention to anything for fear that i would be caught taking it seriously when everyone else was already in the comfort zone of cynicism about it and mocking those who aren't in the know. this kind of self concioussness makes you

but i just don't buy the idea that anyone is going to "get into" something because of a pop culture reference. it's the same logic that says "you don't have to do anything, just enlighten people who don't already know and then somehow collective action will take place" - when in actuality the collective is just a bunch of individuals counting on the other to do something. this logic is used as justification for people to make shitty art that serves as nothing but enemy propaganda because it's got no substance just endless references. oh look family guy's on our side it's anti war! it's on the side of all the other anti war people who are against the war but won't do anything about it except punish their individuality because the collective will doesn't. to my horror and naievity, when iraq happened i really did expect people to feel the same way as me and actually do something about it. but noone wants to give up the comfort of the endless referencing. everyone wants to,and feels that they should, believe in the moral justice of collective social action yet they all want to do it from the standpoint of selfish individualism. they want to protest and then go watch their family guy dvds when they don't feel like protesting. they think that all they have to do is act like they've seen it all before and they can get what they want. what is seth mcflarlane really saying except for "just get into a position were you can reference in comfort with noone calling you out on it, it all ends up in a mush of entertainment anyway". of course what im saying is from the standpoint of my own tortured guilt and relationship to trash culture so i can't pretend to know how everyone else interprets it. the dream is that the virtual aspect of trash culture, the fake aspect and the moral platform it contains, will somehow merge with reality and take its place/patch it up. this is all our dreams because we can't make the distinction between virtuality and reality anymore. i get pissed off when i see jello biafra wearing a cowboy outfit ironically now obama has won for the same reason i'm pissed off at family guys anti bush jokes that come after he's out of office. they both suggest a false resistance and a false position that is used to try to rid the guilt of someone who'se so right wing they feel guilt that they don't stop the war and become the perfect democratic god/jesus combo because if that's not what we should act is possible then hell our very notion of self must be a sham and thus my own subjectivity will disintegrate and it'sall just chaos after all.

what i don't like is how, family guy itself, as you say "makes it silly" to read dostoevsky because you heard about him from fg. it has the affect of neutering the very culture it uses to legitimise itself. it makes you think that you can somehow gain the insight instantly without thinking about it. not that dostoevsky is exactly the most important author in the world that is necessarily going to have more value and a greater affect on some reader than other authors, but still, shit imagine turning off family guy and reading. its good for the mind. shit imagine turning off the whole inescapable ENTERTAINMENT sludge itself and not wanting to seek enjoyment anymore.

i don't think fg is a "sickening reflection of our culture". i don't buy the reflection or moral mirror we hold up to guilt trip ourselves due to the necessity of our culture idea. i think fg IS the culture and the culture just plays at offering a reflection of a false reality. i don't accept the alibi of "i'm just providing a reflection of what's already there".