[Peterpuff]

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

holy fuck i had forgotten how fucking much walt LIES

he’s a machine now

They really do a great job of making you hate him by the end.

[Rob Instigator]

still watching LAST KINGDOM,

[ilduclo]

anybody check out Turn Up Charlie? Idriss Elba, but the story line seems suspect to me...

New BBC series Warren is pretty funny

[h8kurdt]

Originally Posted by ilduclo

anybody check out Turn Up Charlie? Idriss Elba, but the story line seems suspect to me...

New BBC series Warren is pretty funny

Get fucked. In the first five minutes they shit on Preston four times. And anyone who's loved here for as long as Clunes' character is meant to have done would have known Preston was a city. I rage quit pretty sharpish after the last episode.

Yes I like my city

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Peterpuff

They really do a great job of making you hate him by the end.

by the very end i felt for him again

season 4 when he has a chance to walk and returns for his sheer ego needs and drags jessie into it, and puts his family back at risk, and goes after mike, he becomes really despicable. the whole “i’m in the empire business” thing. ugghhh! horrible person. poisoning brock. fuck! no.

“say my name”.

so in the end he sez to skyler he felt alive. which, sure... but... the damage... daaaaaamn.

[Peterpuff]

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

by the very end i felt for him again

Actually, that can be very true, depending on the person. I remember that being a very serious point of contention at the office during those last 3-5 episodes. Very split down the middle. Some were so ready to see him die, while others were tied back to that last pity-redemption arc.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Peterpuff

Actually, that can be very true, depending on the person. I remember that being a very serious point of contention at the office during those last 3-5 episodes. Very split down the middle. Some were so ready to see him die, while others were tied back to that last pity-redemption arc.

not last 3-5 for me, just the last hours basically, once he’s a dead man walking and confesses to skyler and all that.

one thing he forgot, the nazis have people in the jails... oops!

[Severian]

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

not last 3-5 for me, just the last hours basically, once he’s a dead man walking and confesses to skyler and all that.

one thing he forgot, the nazis have people in the jails... oops!

He became the villain and Jesse became the hero, and maybe that was always the case? But in the final season, you really feel it. Like.. things *need* to work out for the little shit we hated at the beginning oh god please let them work out for him, and they *need* to NOT work out for the guy we felt bad for in the beginning.

It’s a great villain story. How are real-world villains are made? Insecure men (and women) end up in situations where they feel they’ve being mistreated, or some great injustice has been done to them, and they start excusing away their souls to right the perceived wrong until they become Lex fucking Luthor.

I mean, look at Trump. All because of a few Obama jokes (and an intrinsic hatred for women, minorities, poor people and knowledge)

Anyhooooo, I regained some affection for Walt by the end, but I was actively rooting against him for a couple seasons at least.

Jesse, Jesse, he’s our man, if he can’t do it, he’s probably ... y’know... stoned

[!@#$%!]

jesse... lol i don't know. he's got some nice instincts but at the same time he's in some ways a complete moron. cannot relate.

anyway watching right now SEASON 3 of better call saul. yes the one that's been up online for a while.

funny thing, that cinnabon in nebraska where he's a manager (he announced his fate in breaking bad) is actually cottonwood mall in albuquerque ha ha ha ha.

[Severian]

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

jesse... lol i don't know. he's got some nice instincts but at the same time he's in some ways a complete moron. cannot relate.

anyway watching right now SEASON 3 of better call saul. yes the one that's been up online for a while.

funny thing, that cinnabon in nebraska where he's a manager (he announced his fate in breaking bad) is actually cottonwood mall in albuquerque ha ha ha ha.

I done been to that mall.


You don’t have to relate to Jesse to know that he becomes the “good guy.” Also oohh look at me I’m Slambang I can only relate to brilliance!

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Severian

I done been to that mall.


You don’t have to relate to Jesse to know that he becomes the “good guy.” Also oohh look at me I’m Slambang I can only relate to brilliance!

yeah i can only...

he actually reminds me of a stoner girl i once fooled around with. they talk kind of the same way and all-- a certain accent that belongs to a certain time.

she was kinda gorgeous and sweet, and smelled delicious, and smoked only the best ganja. but we just failed to click, hard as we tried. it's like the universe would short circuit when we touched, and the cosmic software would glitch. weird shit would happen.

like seinfeld chess but metaphysical

anyway i don't think jesse is really a good guy. he's just not as bad as the others. plus, really, an idiot on many levels.

...

mike. mike was the good guy, in his own way. a killer, but had a code, never gratuitous, and loyal. jesse saw that. mike was the good guy.

[Severian]

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

yeah i can only...

he actually reminds me of a stoner girl i once fooled around with. they talk kind of the same way and all-- a certain accent that belongs to a certain time.

she was kinda gorgeous and sweet, and smelled delicious, and smoked only the best ganja. but we just failed to click, hard as we tried. it's like the universe would short circuit when we touched, and the cosmic software would glitch. weird shit would happen.

like seinfeld chess but metaphysical

anyway i don't think jesse is really a good guy. he's just not as bad as the others. plus, really, an idiot on many levels.

...

mike. mike was the good guy, in his own way. a killer, but had a code, never gratuitous, and loyal. jesse saw that. mike was the good guy.

Ok, so Jesse was the story of a conscience developing. Walt was the story of a conscience dying. Mike was the story of stone-cold Darwinian survivalism — pragmatic, order applied to the bad, but ultimately bad on the outside, good on the inside.

Not sure how you can think Jesse is a bad guy and Mike is a good guy.

We need one of those dumb meme morality maps that Game of Thrones fans use. Haha

[ilduclo]

New Star Trek is the best part of the franchise yet. Bringing in the Talosians was masterful writing...I’m wondering, though, if we will see “Pike in a box”, to keep with the early original....it would seem pretty improbable, but to get it figured out would be pretty fantastic.

There are a couple of annoying characters, though...especially Tilley and the science doc.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Severian

Ok, so Jesse was the story of a conscience developing. Walt was the story of a conscience dying. Mike was the story of stone-cold Darwinian survivalism — pragmatic, order applied to the bad, but ultimately bad on the outside, good on the inside.

Not sure how you can think Jesse is a bad guy and Mike is a good guy.

We need one of those dumb meme morality maps that Game of Thrones fans use. Haha

is he a conscience developing? i don’t know. he was always a nice guy, if you remember he supposedly took care of his aunt. his parents are a bit sociopathic i think. you ever read “people of the lie”? they remind me of that. he’s nice to his little brother.

but at the same time he’s always been corrupt. he’s a degenerate addict, he’s in a criminal enterprise way before walter shows up, then he has a number of deaths on him. yes, he has limits, and those limits get tested, but he’s no saint. and when he fucks up he runs away to having a constant party which numbs him. that’s not responsible. when he goes to rehab he “accepts himself” as “the bad guy” and games the meetings to sell meth. he’s also responsible for his girlfriend dying—he gets her off recovery, they blackmail walt together, etc.

like everyone else he’s corrupt and like everyone else he has limits, but he’s just weaker (and dumber) than the rest. ok he’s not completely dumb, he has some good ideas, but lacks discipline, consistency, good sense, etc. he fucks up often and endangers everyone.

sure he was trying to quit the business but what was he gonna do with his millions? snort them...? he ends up caged instead. sure, walt is the worst piece of shit at that point, so jesse only looks good by comparison.

jesse is chaotic evil — and weak

mike is lawful neutral — and strong

im classifying him as neutral because all he’s trying to do is look after his grandaughter while keeping casualties low. he’s trustworthy, honorable, loyal, does not sell out his guys to save money....so the good and the evil neutralize each other, lol.

if he’s neutral where everyone else is evil he’s therefore the relative good guy

[Severian]

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

is he a conscience developing? i don’t know. he was always a nice guy, if you remember he supposedly took care of his aunt. his parents are a bit sociopathic i think. you ever read “people of the lie”? they remind me of that. he’s nice to his little brother.

but at the same time he’s always been corrupt. he’s a degenerate addict, he’s in a criminal enterprise way before walter shows up, then he has a number of deaths on him. yes, he has limits, and those limits get tested, but he’s no saint. and when he fucks up he runs away to having a constant party which numbs him. that’s not responsible. when he goes to rehab he “accepts himself” as “the bad guy” and games the meetings to sell meth. he’s also responsible for his girlfriend dying—he gets her off recovery, they blackmail walt together, etc.

like everyone else he’s corrupt and like everyone else he has limits, but he’s just weaker (and dumber) than the rest. ok he’s not completely dumb, he has some good ideas, but lacks discipline, consistency, good sense, etc. he fucks up often and endangers everyone.

sure he was trying to quit the business but what was he gonna do with his millions? snort them...? he ends up caged instead. sure, walt is the worst piece of shit at that point, so jesse only looks good by comparison.

jesse is chaotic evil — and weak

mike is lawful neutral — and strong

im classifying him as neutral because all he’s trying to do is look after his grandaughter while keeping casualties low. he’s trustworthy, honorable, loyal, does not sell out his guys to save money....so the good and the evil neutralize each other, lol.

if he’s neutral where everyone else is evil he’s therefore the relative good guy

Maybe I need to rewatch the show.

But I saw Jesse emerging as a Jiminy Cricket in the last few seasons. He’s a professional victim, for sure, but he wanted out. Everything he did weighed on him and he had to constantly be cajoled back into things by Walt.

So maybe I’m confusing his weakness and constant victimhood for conscience, but I still found myself wanting him to “win” and Walt to “lose” for the last stretch of the show.

Also, it’s picky, but I’m not sure how common meth overdoses are... not very. Like cocaine, probably. Maybe less lethal. Not a substance that makes it harder and harder for your body to work properly like heroin. So I’m not sure you can attribute countless deaths to Jessse because he slanged crystal.

You can *most definitely* attribute countless deaths to Mike, who was shooting and killing motherfuckers Punisher-style long before BB, and damn near killed both the main characters on severa occasions.

I’ll agree Mike’s lawful evil, but I’m not sure about Jesse being chaotic evil at the end of the show.

Also, Walt is responsible for Jessica Jones girl’s death. Directly. Not Jesse. He’s not responsible for her relapse, either. She was a recovery fraud with one foot off the wagon, looking for an excuse and Jesse presented one. And SHE is to blame for getting HIM into heroin. As much as anyone other than the person who decides to do something can be blamed for that thing being done.

Anywhooooo

Point is I think the character changed.

But then again, the ending is similar to the ending of Trainspotting, where it appears to be triumphant on the surface, but under the scrutiny of cold, hard reality, both Jesse and whatshisass from TS were probably heading right back into the mouth of the beast when the narrative ended.

Dunno.

[!@#$%!]

oh at the end of the show who knows what jesse is anymore. a mental patient most likely. they fucked him up good. he leaves howling towards who knows what.

of course walt was more evil cuz he was way smarter. he starts behind jesse and surpasses him in every way. turns into a monster. walter went nuts with the murder rampages and power trips. even jesse, who was his vicarious son, eventually became a target.

as for the offing people, mike always did it for a cause, within a specific context, never unnecessarily, and always mindful of consequences. he was even dad-like towards jesse, much more so than crazy walt.

[Severian]

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

oh at the end of the show who knows what jesse is anymore. a mental patient most likely. they fucked him up good. he leaves howling towards who knows what.

of course walt was more evil cuz he was way smarter. he starts behind jesse and surpasses him in every way. turns into a monster. walter went nuts with the murder rampages and power trips. even jesse, who was his vicarious son, eventually became a target.

as for the offing people, mike always did it for a cause, within a specific context, never unnecessarily, and always mindful of consequences. he was even dad-like towards jesse, much more so than crazy walt.

Yah yah I getcha.

Jesse and Mike (and Saul) were always my favorite characters.

Getting me in the mood to rewatch!

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Severian

Yah yah I getcha.

Jesse and Mike (and Saul) were always my favorite characters.

Getting me in the mood to rewatch!

worth it, like any good novel

[!@#$%!]

RUSSIAN DOLL on netflix

 

i started skeptical about the groundhog day premise but then it's getting interesting

it's with the junky chick from orange and she's great/funny like in the other

[Severian]

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

RUSSIAN DOLL on netflix

 

i started skeptical about the groundhog day premise but then it's getting interesting

it's with the junky chick from orange and she's great/funny like in the other

Yah ended up liking this one