[ann ashtray]

Christianity, no doubt, has by far been the worst as far as trying to push it's beliefs on the rest of the world.

But yeah, 9/11, sad stuff. Remember that day well and suspect I always will. There was and is a lot to be learned from it.

[gast30]

Originally Posted by jon boy

have you been in a coma for some years? the world is full of war and horror. off hand i can think of several wars that have happened and continue to happen in my lifetime, some that will happen for a long time to come.

here are some words you may find useful: war makes some people rich.

no i have not been in a coma
that is the last thing i was into

what do you want me to do?
what do people who kill to give a message want me to do?
what do peacefull people want me to do?

i have seen all wars on tv
like everyone who has a tv has seen the war

study this effect it has on me
i feel really unconfortable, i feel powerless, i feel paranoia ect.
my feelings

i also know that feelings are manipulated, exploited to make me sort of choose sides and those kind of manipulations

from that rational preventional piont
i neutrelize my emotions, i study these and i can apply it to myself
i don't know how others deal with emotions (high emotions)

i see it like this

me in the middle of the biggest ocean on earth
have a tv that gives visuals and information about war

to me the info comes like waves
a wave iraque 40 dead
another wave afganistan 40 dead
another wave libia 3000 dead
another wave mass woman rape africa
another wave etnic african war 1000 of dead
another wave mexico drugviolence 30 dead

so if all that information is real
real blood of my sapian family
then the ocean around me turned into blood

it's all real

the most important thing to learn from this
that this has an impact on people
even if 90% of the people don't want war

who is creating these problems
a small group of people who are in a psychose
who lost the reality that they kill and hurt people
destroy the future for the childeren and so on and on

this small group of indivisuals are in a psychose
i call it the psychose of the psychopat -non stop killings of people

they don't understand they kill childeren and destroy the future of childeren

why does a person gets into a psychopatic state of mind?

you better leave that to professionals

i can explain it from my piont of vieuw if some understands it i don't know

treeclimers, groups chimpansees

to keep it simple
2 islands
same specie chimpansee we name 1 group A and other group B

island of group A for example has no more food
chimpansees from group A a naturally directed to island B for survival

what is group B going to do?

you can't know
it's a natural creature
can react in all kinds of ways

what is not changed is the specie
it's still a chimpansee group meeting another chimpansee group

a sapian is a bit more complicated then a chimpansee

the group of sapians 7 billion
are same specie

if they wake up or not, if all 7 billion of them are in a coma, is not the question

you can talk about it and talk about
from psychological pionts of vieuws
from natural pionts of vieuws
and all other pionts of vieuws your brain possibily can make

my thought is from intellectual piont of vieuw
accepting modern information
same specie is same specie
same dna familytree

if you want peace in all the tommorows to come
my thought is that the sapian found it's origin and accepts it
there is nothing wrong with modern information
like DNA is 98% chimpansee simular

the natural state is maybe difficult to find
because of parents, friends, school, tv, radio, internet
all that information is spoonfed, most didn't had a chance to think for themself

i think our natural state is natural calm
what humans name in the word peace

so if every sapian individually tunes in their origin radio " natural calm " peace
then all tommorows are waves of peace
that would reach me as i would be there in the middle of the ocean

peace and love to the world
we got to get out of the past
the past can be like war residue

just live in natural calm state for all the tommorows to come

[the ikara cult]

My second day at college 10 yrs ago (which is 16-18 in UK years), it happened about 1.30 our time but since there was no broadband internet or anything like that, i didnt find out til i got home at 5 or so. My mum was pacing around afraid that Bush was gonna push the button. It was a fiarly jarring time both personally and politically.

the weirdest thing i remember is we had a Politics lesson the next day, this being EXACTLY the kind of thing i took a Politics course to be able to understand, and the teacher didnt even mention it to us.

[DeadDiscoDildo]

Originally Posted by ann ashtray

Christianity, no doubt, has by far been the worst as far as trying to push it's beliefs on the rest of the world.

But yeah, 9/11, sad stuff. Remember that day well and suspect I always will. There was and is a lot to be learned from it.

Maybe the most successful, definitley not the worst.

[gast30]

9/11 also created alot of conspiracy theories around itself
from groups like the belgium belfort group that mixes it conspiracy from all kinda freemadson groups in combination with political learders or what so ever

for them 9/11 has become a believe for their 'truth'

a psychologist did explain it wel
he said because of these people come together with conspiracy ideas
they strenghten their idea's their believe there is a conspiracy

even if experts give other result
they simple not going to believe it

this is a side effect what 9/11 have created
or better what these conspiricy groups have created

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by ann ashtray

Christianity, no doubt, has by far been the worst as far as trying to push it's beliefs on the rest of the world.

.

Are you done throwing your little tantrum there? Don't realize that what you are saying is no different then the John Hagees or the Jihadists of the world? It is exaggerated, biased, and intolerant, the very things you seem to be against. It is intolerant, asshole attitudes like this that brought about 9/11, and until we rid these from our societies, then hatred and violence will continue.

Christianity is not a person, it is a concept, which has done nothing to anyone. Neither did Islam knock down the Twin Towers, or did political radicalism blow up the federal building in Oklahoma City. People did these things. People with hatred and violence in their hearts. The only cure to hatred and violence is sincere love and peace.

Honestly, intolerant and bigoted attitudes do not reflect either love or peace, and so are only more so part of the problem, not the solution.

as for me, I pray for you, me, them, and us all.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

also, am I the only one who noticed that the 9/11 Memorial seems a bit insensitive in the fact that the waterfalls seem eerily reminiscent of the Towers fall themselves? The designers said it was to signify the perpetuity of the human spirit, but it seems to be a bit insensitive considering the event itself was falling buildings, and the lined spacing of the monument created by the weirs looks spot on like the design of the World Trade Towers, particular as they were falling

 

my God, I must admit those are surreal and frightening images still ten years later..

[floatingslowly]

it truly is a shame that nobody other than my (ex) sister in law chose to listen to my doomcrying back in 1999; but I guess that's not my problem.

[DeadDiscoDildo]

^^what do u mean? you were a y2k'er or you thought problems were coming after the 99 boat bombing.

[the ikara cult]

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous

Are you done throwing your little tantrum there? Don't realize that what you are saying is no different then the John Hagees or the Jihadists of the world? It is exaggerated, biased, and intolerant, the very things you seem to be against. It is intolerant, asshole attitudes like this that brought about 9/11, and until we rid these from our societies, then hatred and violence will continue.

Christianity is not a person, it is a concept, which has done nothing to anyone. Neither did Islam knock down the Twin Towers, or did political radicalism blow up the federal building in Oklahoma City. People did these things. People with hatred and violence in their hearts. The only cure to hatred and violence is sincere love and peace.

Honestly, intolerant and bigoted attitudes do not reflect either love or peace, and so are only more so part of the problem, not the solution.

as for me, I pray for you, me, them, and us all.

Not to start a whole discussion about religion again, but THEIR PARTICULAR READING OF Islam is responsible for 9/11.
If a solution to the Israel/Palestine situation had been found, the attackers would still have attacked in some form. If the US stopped supporting Israel so heavily, the attackers would still have attacked in some form. If the Saudis had stopped trading with the US.... etc. Insert every demand Al Quaeda made

The only thing that would be satisfactory to them would be to concede every single little thing they desired, which of course is impossible.
However, if they suddenly started questioning their religion, stopped thinking that they would get to paradise and have 72 virgins after murdering 3000 people (the fact they only killed <3000 is still absolutely incredible) I have a feeling that would have done more in dissuading them from carrying out the attacks.

And people like John Hagee and that Koran burning idiot pastor might have a little more credibility when talking about Islam if they werent extremist religious nutcases themselves.

[gast30]

Originally Posted by the ikara cult

Not to start a whole discussion about religion again, but THEIR PARTICULAR READING OF Islam is responsible for 9/11.
If a solution to the Israel/Palestine situation had been found, the attackers would still have attacked in some form. If the US stopped supporting Israel so heavily, the attackers would still have attacked in some form. If the Saudis had stopped trading with the US.... etc. Insert every demand Al Quaeda made

The only thing that would be satisfactory to them would be to concede every single little thing they desired, which of course is impossible.
However, if they suddenly started questioning their religion, stopped thinking that they would get to paradise and have 72 virgins after murdering 3000 people (the fact they only killed <3000 is still absolutely incredible) I have a feeling that would have done more in dissuading them from carrying out the attacks.

And people like John Hagee and that Koran burning idiot pastor might have a little more credibility when talking about Islam if they werent extremist religious nutcases themselves.

everyone knows that propaganda is a lie to start a war to keep people submissive to sick ideas of killing and hating peoples

propaganda makes extreemist see "an enemy" while there is no

they make unstable persons aggression stress focused into an attack act of violence

they give their own version of 'the religion'

the thing is it starts in jemen with osama's family
then to afganistan russian war with support of the us
then after that war
there was war residue that got it focus on other muslim populations that are in conflickt
they see america or isreal + america as the enemy causing all this
and random attacking people
many muslim died by muslim terrorist
they kill most of their own people

it's a psychological thing
brainwashing > propaganda > killing hating > seeing the 'enemy'

really dangerous cycles repeating and making 1000 's of death

you should look at the obsession the human has with power
during history

if you take europe
the time that the wild animals are dissapearing and people had to start agriculture and fights for land started
stonehenge druids, vikings turning christian, king arthur in england
then later napolean, hitler
all powersick people
the animals obsession for power never seems to leave

tell that to your childeren

[the ikara cult]

Gast, if you are for real, your posts do not make any kind of coherant sense, so its impossible for me to respond to anything you say. You seem to think that you are the only person who has ever thought about anything properly, ever.

[gast30]

Originally Posted by the ikara cult

Gast, if you are for real, your posts do not make any kind of coherant sense, so its impossible for me to respond to anything you say. You seem to think that you are the only person who has ever thought about anything properly, ever.

that is what you think, now
i can't say 'sorry' ikara, because it's not my intion to make you impossible to respond
and don't think i'm the only person who had done some thinking

found it difficult to explain from my perspective
how i live life
and use words to talk about difficult things happening in 'the human world'

if i'm for real
i personally see myself as an animal like a cow,horse or chimpansee

if a cow , horse and chimpansees are real for you
then i'm real too

i can make a seperation between living in a sort of disney land world
and real evolution life as an animal
i thought that makes me modern in thinking, not more then an other animal

[Pelle]

10 frickin years...it really feels like it was a long time ago...or am I the only one?

[gast30]

feels like 10 years of ugly war and that i only forget how ugly it was for the people who have been in that war
they have to live with it
i only see it on tv

[cagedbird]

Remember the benefit Sonic Youth played at Bowery Ballroom?

[ilduclo]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slKNd22GGaQ

[cagedbird]

keep calm and carry on

keep dreamin

the girl is mine

hmph

[SONIC GAIL]

I remember sitting on my bed and recieveing a phone call from one of our clients informing us that one of the twin towers had been destroyed and we should turn on the news. We did. We witnessed the tower crumble and then watched as the second was struck by a fucking passenger plane. We witnessed them both crumble before our eyes on live TV. Yes shocking. Things you hear about in history like the Kennedy assasination. Don't think we really accept it this day. My 9 year old son was given the extra credit assignment of watching a documentry of these happenings for extra credit. We watched about the pentagon. I am sure that in our town this will come as an anomally. He knew alot more thanI thought. The little shit soaks up info like a spounge. He took 3 pages of notes. My child WILL survive in this world full of shit.

[gast30]

yesterday night seen a docu on 9/11 from 9:00h to 10:20h
videos from all kinda place around ny minute after minute

you could see all that happend in that hour and half clearly
it was a really heavy happening
the people on top of the towers who climed out of windows hoping someone comes to rescue them
fireman suck in the building and the fast collapse of the towers
in 3 seconds it was fallen all the way down creating massive very dangerous thick clouds that spread and suprised the people still running away from the scene