[luxinterior]

Originally Posted by Norma J

They were filming.

Did you have your pants down? That could be embarrassing.

I eventually had my pants down. At least I didn't shit.

(Note: Pooping at school is the weirdest thing I have ever heard of).

[floatingslowly]

jesus is a counterfeiter!

[Hip Priest]

As someone religious, yet who isn't (I hope) a 'fucking cunt', and whose religious friends are also not (in my opinion) 'fucking cunts', I would just like to say that the word 'evangelical' has been hijacked and damaged just as much as 'liberal' has.

'Evangelical' really refers to the more-or-less essential attempts by a Christian to share the gospel with non-Christians. Many have abused the word, but they have, more fundamentally, abused the word 'Christian'. We are warned of these people in the Bible (the epistle of Jude, verse 4, springs to mind: For certain men whose condemnation was written about[b] long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are godless men, who change the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord.).

It's easy to try to silence people and tell them they should not speak, or just to bully and abuse, but fortunately most of us still live in countries where that sort of nasty dictatorial nonsense isn't yet practiced.

In Manchester recently, the local Muslims had put up a tent in the city centre. They shared beliefs, food and discussion with anyone who cared to join in, and it was a really good effort. I'm often handed stuff by jewish, Muslim and Buddhist groups, and I have to say that in most cases there is a genuine attempt between all parties to be tolerant and interested in each other's faith. The need to tear up each other's holy books, call each other 'fucking cunts' or issue command such as 'go to hell' and 'fuck off' are thankfully felt to be unnecessary. It's a good job that most people, religious or atheist, are more tolerant than some would like.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by luxinterior

...when I stopped off at the bathroom before class. So I'm in the stall unbuttoning my jeans when I see a folded-up $20 bill sitting on top of the toilet paper dispenser. So I get very excited for a moment, that is, until I unfold the bill and find out that it is not real. And not only is it not real, it also has printed on it some stuff about Jesus and how my reward in heaven is greater than that of a $20 bill. Now, all I want to ask is, WHAT KIND OF PERSON DOES THIS? Please, enlighten me, if you will. Do they think that I or someone else will find this sort of tactic amusing? Obviously they've just assumed that we're all lost souls in need of saving or some other trash, without any thought that perhaps I've been raised Catholic and I don't need one more person telling me shit about God, and that finding a very real-looking fake $20 bill is going to be more disappointing and make me feel more resentful toward God and "his people" than anything else? But mainly I want to know who does this sort of thing, so if you know the answer, please share it with me. Also, why can't these people keep their religion out of my school? I don't understand the point for them where church and service work become not enough and they have to venture outward and disappoint people with fake $20 bills. I can only think that this sort of thing is mean. Not funny, not cute, not clever, but mean. Most of the people who go to my school aren't financially secure and could really use an extra $20 here and there. It really has become the difference between whether I eat a proper meal for lunch (for once) instead of settling for a tiny bag of chips from the vending machine and a trip to the water fountain. Really, what's the deal?

you really shouldn't be so offended. When I was walking home from school once years ago I found a sticker on the floor that said "Smash Jew Conspired Communism and Anti-Christ Race Mixing" and in even bigger print "HEY NIGGER GOD IS WHITE!"

the scariest part was that I am in Los Angeles and the sticker had a local mailing address and phone number for info. At the time, I thought that kinda shit only existed in south carolina...

[luxinterior]

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous

you really shouldn't be so offended. When I was walking home from school once years ago I found a sticker on the floor that said "Smash Jew Conspired Communism and Anti-Christ Race Mixing" and in even bigger print "HEY NIGGER GOD IS WHITE!"

the scariest part was that I am in Los Angeles and the sticker had a local mailing address and phone number for info. At the time, I thought that kinda shit only existed in south carolina...

I beg to differ. What really bothered me about the whole thing was how anyone could think that such a method is even appropriate. "Hey, I'm going to make you think for a split second that you can actually afford to pay for gas this week without having to dip into the money you normally use for food and other groceries. And then I'm going to yank that hope away from you with my bullshit recruiting tactics, with no thought that you might have heard all of this before, repeatedly, IN CHURCH AND/OR SCHOOL FOR THE PAST TWO DECADES." There are better ways of "spreading the Good News," I would hope.

[Hip Priest]

Originally Posted by luxinterior

...There are better ways of "spreading the Good News," I would hope.

Amen.

There certainly are.

[luxinterior]

Originally Posted by Hip Priest

As someone religious, yet who isn't (I hope) a 'fucking cunt', and whose religious friends are also not (in my opinion) 'fucking cunts', I would just like to say that the word 'evangelical' has been hijacked and damaged just as much as 'liberal' has.

'Evangelical' really refers to the more-or-less essential attempts by a Christian to share the gospel with non-Christians. Many have abused the word, but they have, more fundamentally, abused the word 'Christian'. We are warned of these people in the Bible (the epistle of Jude, verse 4, springs to mind: For certain men whose condemnation was written about[b] long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are godless men, who change the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord.).

It's easy to try to silence people and tell them they should not speak, or just to bully and abuse, but fortunately most of us still live in countries where that sort of nasty dictatorial nonsense isn't yet practiced.

In Manchester recently, the local Muslims had put up a tent in the city centre. They shared beliefs, food and discussion with anyone who cared to join in, and it was a really good effort. I'm often handed stuff by jewish, Muslim and Buddhist groups, and I have to say that in most cases there is a genuine attempt between all parties to be tolerant and interested in each other's faith. The need to tear up each other's holy books, call each other 'fucking cunts' or issue command such as 'go to hell' and 'fuck off' are thankfully felt to be unnecessary. It's a good job that most people, religious or atheist, are more tolerant than some would like.

I do hope that I didn't offend you with any of my posts, because I value your opinion on topics such as this one. You always approach these things in a very level-headed way, which will lend a nice balance to a thread like this wherein I am basically generalizing left and right because of a number of things that have occurred in the past few months relating to religion and it kind of sent me over the edge after the $20 bill thing. Money is tight, I really am broke, and I can't even begin to understand how a Christian person could think that it is okay to deceive someone like that and actually expect it to go over well with the person who ends up finding it.

[Hip Priest]

Originally Posted by luxinterior

I do hope that I didn't offend you with any of my posts, because I value your opinion on topics such as this one. You always approach these things in a very level-headed way, which will lend a nice balance to a thread like this wherein I am basically generalizing left and right because of a number of things that have occurred in the past few months relating to religion and it kind of sent me over the edge after the $20 bill thing. Money is tight, I really am broke, and I can't even begin to understand how a Christian person could think that it is okay to deceive someone like that and actually expect it to go over well with the person who ends up finding it.

No, no, of course you haven't. Your posts are pretty much uniformly brilliant.

I was thinking more of the students at k-krack's school. Tearing up Bibles and throwing abuse is moronic. I fail to see why some types of bigotry are cool. It's the same kind of hatred that racists and xenophobes use.

You're right about the con, too. There is no room for deception or dishonesty in Christianity.

[Hip Priest]

Originally Posted by pbradley

I remember some christians were passing out condoms at my high school so we started blowing them up and tossing them around. My smartass friends and I started hitting on our female friends in front of the christians about how we wanted to fuck them with our large, uncircumcised penis with no protection in front of our pagan idols. One came over to us and gave us a good witnessing.

What's wrong with giving out free contraception? What's wrong with helping to prevent unwanted pregnancy and equally unwanted STD's? Christians get enough slagging off due to our alleged total opposition to pre-marital sex. These people were at least showing that intolerance isn't always the case.

[Everyneurotic]

i collect those pamphlets and flyers and stuff because i think their recruiting methods are absurd and many of those people are more interested in getting their hands in someone's money than in getting them into their chosen spiritual path.

nothing wrong with christians or catholics or anybody really. i don't get the evangelical part of christianity, though, i understand what it is and why they do it, but i just don't get how a person think it's their mission to get people to think alike.

[pbradley]

Originally Posted by Hip Priest

What's wrong with giving out free contraception? What's wrong with helping to prevent unwanted pregnancy and equally unwanted STD's? Christians get enough slagging off due to our alleged total opposition to pre-marital sex. These people were at least showing that intolerance isn't always the case.

You act as though we were counter-protesting them.

We were smartass high school students goofing around.

[Hip Priest]

Fair enough.

[Hip Priest]

Originally Posted by Everyneurotic

i collect those pamphlets and flyers and stuff because i think their recruiting methods are absurd and many of those people are more interested in getting their hands in someone's money than in getting them into their chosen spiritual path.

Never go a church that asks for money before it offers fellowship.

Never go to a church that pressures you on how much to give, or demands to know how much you give.

And my advice is to be suspicious of any ministry named after its minister.

Originally Posted by Everyneurotic

nothing wrong with christians or catholics or anybody really. i don't get the evangelical part of christianity, though, i understand what it is and why they do it, but i just don't get how a person think it's their mission to get people to think alike.

Basically, it's because Jesus gave express instructions to spread the word, to go and take on the (difficult and often hateful) world with humility and kindness; and it's a theme that has run all the way through the Christian narrative ever since.

Apart from that, it's human nature to want to spread good news.

[Everyneurotic]

the thing is that judaism doesn't have that part on it's m.o., nor does islam or buddism, and yeah, christianity is more of a collective thought instead of a focus on the individual. i just don't get it, my way of being for everything is "this is good for me but it's up to you if you want to give it a try".

then again, i know jewish people who can't stop trying to get to talk to anybody about their beliefs in hopes of converting them, something that doesn't get in my head more than evangelism.

[Hip Priest]

Originally Posted by Everyneurotic

the thing is that judaism doesn't have that part on it's m.o., nor does islam or buddism, and yeah, christianity is more of a collective thought instead of a focus on the individual. i just don't get it, my way of being for everything is "this is good for me but it's up to you if you want to give it a try".

then again, i know jewish people who can't stop trying to get to talk to anybody about their beliefs in hopes of converting them, something that doesn't get in my head more than evangelism.

It's really just based on what Jesus instructed; there's a natural feeling (and desire) to sense that you are being sent out. But the issue should never be forced against people's will, because that's not the true Christian way.

Personally, of course, I love talking to religious people of any faith, because I think that we can learn a lot from each other. Doctrine put to one side, others' words about the actual seeking, discovery and maintaining of faith can be immensely helpful. Jewish people are great to talk to, I find. The only ones I kind of have problems with are the Mormons, who are always very nice but tend in my experience to lose interest in you as a person when it's clear that they can't convert you to their specific way of thought.

[Everyneurotic]

Originally Posted by Hip Priest

It's really just based on what Jesus instructed; there's a natural feeling (and desire) to sense that you are being sent out. But the issue should never be forced against people's will, because that's not the true Christian way.

Personally, of course, I love talking to religious people of any faith, because I think that we can learn a lot from each other. Doctrine put to one side, others' words about the actual seeking, discovery and maintaining of faith can be immensely helpful. Jewish people are great to talk to, I find. The only ones I kind of have problems with are the Mormons, who are always very nice but tend in my experience to lose interest in you as a person when it's clear that they can't convert you to their specific way of thought.

weird but i guess it's a strong feeling if you have it.

i sympathize with this post wholeheartedly.

[Green_mind]

Originally Posted by Hip Priest

Personally, of course, I love talking to religious people of any faith, because I think that we can learn a lot from each other. Doctrine put to one side, others' words about the actual seeking, discovery and maintaining of faith can be immensely helpful.

What exactly do you learn?
Do you believe that everyone could become a better person if they were to believe in your religion?

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Hip Priest

As someone religious, yet who isn't (I hope) a 'fucking cunt', and whose religious friends are also not (in my opinion) 'fucking cunts', I would just like to say that the word 'evangelical' has been hijacked and damaged just as much as 'liberal' has.

'Evangelical' really refers to the more-or-less essential attempts by a Christian to share the gospel with non-Christians. Many have abused the word, but they have, more fundamentally, abused the word 'Christian'. We are warned of these people in the Bible (the epistle of Jude, verse 4, springs to mind: For certain men whose condemnation was written about[b] long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are godless men, who change the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord.).

It's easy to try to silence people and tell them they should not speak, or just to bully and abuse, but fortunately most of us still live in countries where that sort of nasty dictatorial nonsense isn't yet practiced.

In Manchester recently, the local Muslims had put up a tent in the city centre. They shared beliefs, food and discussion with anyone who cared to join in, and it was a really good effort. I'm often handed stuff by jewish, Muslim and Buddhist groups, and I have to say that in most cases there is a genuine attempt between all parties to be tolerant and interested in each other's faith. The need to tear up each other's holy books, call each other 'fucking cunts' or issue command such as 'go to hell' and 'fuck off' are thankfully felt to be unnecessary. It's a good job that most people, religious or atheist, are more tolerant than some would like.

well you may be right, and i don't know the kind of evangelical christianity that you practice, but on this side of the atlantic we have a number of clowns who have hijacked the brains of the populace for their own political and financial ends. you will usually find them hollering "jesus" and hallellujas in every other sentence, and asking you for money on the tv, and screaming about being born again. assholes such as (to name a few)

jerry falwell (fortunately now dead)
jim bakker (ex-convict)
oral roberts
jack van impe
pat robertson (the 700 club)
jimmy swaggart
etc

and many, many many others-- many because it's a profitable con and a political force-- oh yes. i just don't remember all the name.

then there are scary types that are not necessarily on TV but who preach some of the most backwards and superstitions fundamentalism such as the southern baptists (the largest protestant denomination in america).

and then there are all manner of well-intentioned people who willingly flush their brains down the toilet and interpret the "bible" literally. i put that word in quotation marks because you have your jewish bible and then you have the gospel and what is what depends on who you talk to.

as long as people keep their beliefs to themselves i really have no problem, but when they try to keep others from living their lives as they see fit it becomes a war, and in that sense i do see myself at war with these people.

i did not intent to include you or many other innocent people in these categorizations; i have many friends and acquaintances that are, broadly speaking, christian, but none of them (obviously) are the lunatic fanatics that i've described above.

anyway, i forgot where i was going with this, but i invite you to watch a little of one of the groups i love to hate. or.. wait wait... you might appreciate this. start with 1 and follow the rest...

these are 2 separate documentaries:

1) "bible bashers"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6U_B5SPkeNk

2) "the most hated family in america"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O228AQRvcqQ

then you'll realize what we're up against...

[cryptowonderdruginvogue]

...fake 20$?
that's mighty rude

Originally Posted by luxinterior

I've cleaned up so much barf and other bodily fluids on the job (thank you Six Flags) over the summer that the germ thing doesn't really bother me anymore as long as I know I can wash my hands afterward. I was the only girl at those rides who could clean up that stuff without feeling ill so I got stuck doing it most of the time.

you are so brave/strong

[Anngella]

I've seen the one ccalled "Most Hated Family In America." It was a really good documentary ..it made me kind of sad though, to know that people have that much hate in them, and that they use innocent children as bilboards for their propaganda and such. I'll check out the other one later seeing as how I have to go to bed soon and such.

That sucks about the $20 though, Lux. For all the reasons people mentioned. I really haven't had to deal with anything like that in my life thus far, except for these two old ladies who came to my door offering bible study, in which I refused and after they prodded more I just shut the door. I'm very interested in other beliefs (mostly ones that are ancient, though) and I'm willing to talk to other people and sometimes I even follow some of the "rules" they have that I think would make me a better person -though most of my morality comes from my own personal thinking and just general rules of society. There are a lot of relgions I want to learn more about, though. I'm in the (very slow) process of reading the bible from cover to cover, just for the sake of being able to argue it's validity and things better (because I like debating) and for my own personal knowledge. I'd like to learn more about Buddhism and Satanism, however.