[the ikara cult]

Hi Americans

With this whole hooha about this poor kid being shot for the crime of being in posession of a hoodie, some skittles and ebonics, im kinda reminded of why your gun laws are colossally, batshit insane.

Yours sincerely
Dismayed majority of the developed world

[Keeping It Simple]

Originally Posted by the ikara cult

Hi Americans

With this whole hooha about this poor kid being shot for the crime of being in posession of a hoodie, some skittles and ebonics, im kinda reminded of why your gun laws are colossally, batshit insane.

Yours sincerely
Dismayed majority of the developed world

A Russian banker's in a coma after getting shot in London. Despite the UK's draconian gun laws, people are still getting shot here.

[the ikara cult]

Originally Posted by Keeping It Simple

A Russian banker's in a coma after getting shot in London. Despite the UK's draconian gun laws, people are still getting shot here.

are you trolling or making a serious point?

Anyway, the guy in the trayvon martin case hasnt even been arrested, at least the police are investigating the guy from the story you mentioned. Also, kids involved in shooting that poor bangladeshi girl are about to get sent down.

So thats two high profile British cases, in which neither involved a legal firearm. And we have one killing in the US, and the only reason its getting international attention is the fact it appears to be racial in nature. We never hear about the ones that happen for other reasons, but they happen, and they involve legal firearms.

[ann ashtray]

Originally Posted by foreverasskiss

i have a gun and i'll use if i fucking have to.

This.

Only idiots think it's possible to live in a world without firearms. Laws regarding them matter little...they aren't going anywhere.

Super easy to get. Easy and cheap and they exist all over the place legally or illegally.

Gun laws are about as useful as drug laws. How many people do you know that smoke pot? How many people do you know that own a gun? How many people keep it private? A shitload. Most people that own guns are responsible with them. Argument over.

[fugazifan]

Originally Posted by foreverasskiss

this shit happens every fucking day. if it's racist then it sucks. if not, then it sucks. does it fucking matter. this is not the fucking 60's. guns laws. fuckit. more guns. less assholes. fuck the media that tries to single this out as a racist crime.my fucking god.bring attention just to do something about this. i agree. it needs to be done.but it has nothing to do with racism

how does it have nothing to do with racism?

[fugazifan]

i think that while some of that may be true there is still deep rooted institutionalized racism in the US that goes beyond day to day interactions. one example of that is the prison industrial complex and the way in which people of color are much more likely to be incarcerated regardless of crime rates.

and i think that its true that people get killed everyday but there seems to be a reason why this boy was killed and had he been white it seems much less likely that he would have been killed for that reason.

this is from eve goldberg and linda evans work on the prison industrial complex http://globalresearch.ca/articles/EVA110A.html:
"Here at home, the war on drugs has been a war on poor people. Particularly poor, urban, African-American men and women. It's well documented that police enforcement of the new, harsh drug laws have been focused on low- level dealers in communities of color. Arrests of African-Americans have been about five times higher than arrests of whites, although whites and African- Americans use drugs at about the same rate. And, African-Americans have been imprisoned in numbers even more disproportionate than their relative arrest rates. It is estimated that in 1994, on any given day, one out of every 128 U.S. adults was incarcerated, while one out of every 17 African-American adult males was incarcerated. "

[fugazifan]

Arrests of African-Americans have been about five times higher than arrests of whites, although whites and African- Americans use drugs at about the same rate.

[fugazifan]

they didn't say that they use drugs in the same numbers but rather in the same rates. that means that although lets say both communities have a lets say 10% drug use, there will be a higher rate of blacks incarcerated for the same crime. the black community and many communities of color have problems in the us, as well as in canada. but i think that it is wrong to write it off as just problems that have nothing to do with race, and to not look at how these problems came about.

[the ikara cult]

Its a nice ideal to not want skin colour to matter, but in a practical situation, say when a paranoid guy with a gun sees a black kid wearing a hoodie, or when a business wants to hire someone to an important presentational position, suddenly all those ideals go out the window, people panic and resort to their most primitive responses.

We operate on very low levels a lot of the time, we're not all high-minded, we're still very unevolved. It takes recognition of our base nature to discover why we should always strive to be better than it.

"We bear the stamp of our lowly origins" as Darwin said. And the killer certainly displayed his.

[fugazifan]

this past november Kenneth Chamberlain, Sr, a black man, was murdered in his home by the police who were there to help him with a medical situation.
http://www.democracynow.org/2012/3/2...hite_plains_ny

[jon boy]

another one today.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-17590859

[the ikara cult]

remember kids, guns don't kill people, people kill people. With Guns.

[ann ashtray]

People kill people with all sorts of shit. Blaming guns for killing is like blaming drugs for the addict....ie, people take drugs, drugs don't take people.

The majority shouldn't suffer because of a few bad apples. Maybe we should ban cars because of all the stupid car related deaths?

[nicfit]

Originally Posted by ann ashtray

People kill people with all sorts of shit.

My main concern with guns is that there are no second thoughts. If you get "enraged" and start beating someone up it can took quite a while to KILL, you could even change your mind or be stopped before you actually murder someone. With a gun, you pull the trigger and it's done, the other guy coul be dead in a second, and no one would be able to stop you in time nor save him.

Originally Posted by ann ashtray

Maybe we should ban cars because of all the stupid car related deaths?

Really stupid comparison between cars and guns.
Cars are not built to kill people, they have another purpose, in case you didn't notice. Lots of things can kill by accident (especially when used by stupid people). But guns are built for killing people. Period. Unless you live like Homer in that simpsons episode.

[ann ashtray]

Originally Posted by nicfit

My main concern with guns is that there are no second thoughts. If you get "enraged" and start beating someone up it can took quite a while to KILL, you could even change your mind or be stopped before you actually murder someone. With a gun, you pull the trigger and it's done, the other guy coul be dead in a second, and no one would be able to stop you in time nor save him.



Really stupid comparison between cars and guns.
Cars are not built to kill people, they have another purpose, in case you didn't notice. Lots of things can kill by accident (especially when used by stupid people). But guns are built for killing people. Period. Unless you live like Homer in that simpsons episode.

No one can really stop a drunk driver for passing out at the wheel on the interstate during rush hour resulting in numerous fatal accidents. Also, guns aren't intended to kill people, either. Of course they can kill people, but so can explosives which are far easier for some kid to build in his garage. Guns, in most cases, are used as a deterrent (as I've said countless times, most that might be considering a crime against one with a gun are more likely to reconsider whatever crime. If one doesn't own a gun, less likely to reconsider crime). NOT considering war, I bet guns (not fired) have stopped more crimes from occurring than actual incidents to where triggers have been pulled.

And dude...cars seriously do not always kill by accident. The things are basically large drivable bullets and have been used as such. maybe not as much as guns, but it's happened. Where do you draw the line?

And, how would stricter gun laws change anything? Do you feel strict drug laws make a serious difference? Where there is a demand, there will always be a supply. Guns have been around a long time, homie. I doubt they are going anywhere anytime soon...but still, feel free to dream away.

Guns, in most cases, are used for self protection. A VERY small percentage of folks that own a gun ever actually pull the trigger while pointing it at someone else. MOST PEOPLE DO NOT WANT TO KILL OTHER PEOPLE, period.

[EVOLghost]

Uhh....I'm pretty sure guns are intended to KILL. and yes, that includes people. I don't think people go hunting with AK-47's and M4's. Or even a handgun for that matter..

[nicfit]

Originally Posted by ann ashtray

Guns, in most cases, are used as a deterrent (as I've said countless times, most that might be considering a crime against one with a gun are more likely to reconsider whatever crime. If one doesn't own a gun, less likely to reconsider crime).

Then, according to this logic, USA should have the lowest crime rates in the world, because there are lots of guns around and "criminals" could never know if their victims are carrying, so they'd be spending their lives "reconsidering". And I'm the one who's dreaming?
Lol.

Originally Posted by ann ashtray

NOT considering war, I bet guns (not fired) have stopped more crimes from occurring than actual incidents to where triggers have been pulled.

And how many people have been killed because there are too many guns around in the hands of people who are not coldblooded/trained enough to use them as "deterrent"?

Originally Posted by ann ashtray

Guns, in most cases, are used for self protection. A VERY small percentage of folks that own a gun ever actually pull the trigger while pointing it at someone else. MOST PEOPLE DO NOT WANT TO KILL OTHER PEOPLE, period.

Sure they may do not, that's what scares me about the "impossibility" to change your mind. You get scared, you shoot, you kill. You regret killing for the rest of your life. It's not that you can set your gun to "stun" instead of "kill". Lots of people carrying guns are simply not trained enough on how to use one "properly"(blah), as I said earlier.

I won't even argue with the cars issue because it's just too stupid.

[ann ashtray]

Originally Posted by EVOLghost

Uhh....I'm pretty sure guns are intended to KILL. and yes, that includes people. I don't think people go hunting with AK-47's and M4's. Or even a handgun for that matter..

most people that own these guns use them for little more than target practice.

[EVOLghost]

Originally Posted by ann ashtray

most people that own these guns use them for little more than target practice.

Originally Posted by nicfit

You get scared, you shoot, you kill.

uhhhyeh.

[gmku]

Originally Posted by EVOLghost

Uhh....I'm pretty sure guns are intended to KILL. and yes, that includes people. I don't think people go hunting with AK-47's and M4's. Or even a handgun for that matter..

This. Owning a gun for self-defense is a ridiculous reason--and dangerous. Even if you're the best trained cop, you still can be taken by surprise, and by the time you react to a potential threat (e.g., somebody pulling a gun on you) by reaching for your gun, you'll be shot. Plus your adrenaline will be high and likely will affect your accuracy and control over your weapon.

A scenario like that in real life is unpredictable. Studies have shown that you're likely to put yourself in greater harm by showing that you have a gun--your attacker is more likely to shoot you if he thinks he might get shot by you.