[Rob Instigator]

Every poor white person in amerikkka has been fooled into thinking they would be Trump-level-rich if it wasn't for immigrants, welfare recipients, Democrats, uppity women, and the gays.

[Genteel Death 2]

The global implications of the US elections



The working class has nothing to chose between Trump and Harris, Republicans or Democrats. Whoever wins, the working class will be subjected to the brutal attacks on its living standards demanded by the economic crisis and the build-up of the war economy. Whoever wins, workers will be faced with the need to defend themselves as a class against these attacks

But this does not mean that we can ignore the election campaign and its consequences. They are revealing that the divisions in the US bourgeoisie, the ruling class of what is still the most powerful country in the world, are growing sharper and more violent. The US has become the epicentre of the decomposition of the world capitalist system, and whoever emerges as President after November 5, the election will serve to exacerbate these divisions even more, with serious consequences both within the US itself and on the global stage.

Revolutionaries thus have the task not only of denouncing the fraud of bourgeois democracy, but of analysing the world-wide implications of the US election, of placing them in a coherent framework that will enable us to understand how the fragmentation of the US ruling class is an active factor in the only perspective that the bourgeoisie can offer humanity: an accelerating dive into destruction and chaos. We invite all those who want to fight for a different future to come to this meeting and discuss with us.

The main language of the meeting will be English, but we will have facilities to translate on the spot into other languages as well. If you want to take part, write to us at international@internationalism.org, indicating if you are happy following and contributing in English, or specifying what other language you would need to use.

Date and Time: 16 November 2024, 2pm-5pm UK time
https://en.internationalism.org/cont...s-us-elections

[Severian]

Fuck This Shit

[Toilet & Bowels]

Originally Posted by Rob Instigator

Every poor white person in amerikkka has been fooled into thinking they would be Trump-level-rich if it wasn't for immigrants, welfare recipients, Democrats, uppity women, and the gays.

From what I read Trump has made considerable gains among non-white males

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Toilet & Bowels

From what I read Trump has made considerable gains among non-white males

it's because the non white males have been fooled into thinking they will be accepted as white if only they simp for trump xD

(or something like that, it's like a stockholm syndrome)

then what rob said applies the same

but there is another side that rob forgets to mention:

like republicans and their lies, democrats try to sell the idea that with enough taxes, regulation and red tape, racial and gender quotas, and language policing, everyone will have the right to their precious fee fees not to be disturbed

Originally Posted by Genteel Death 2

The global implications of the US elections
[etc.]

i don't agree with your ideology because i've seen it fail, and you might say it's a matter of implementation while i think it contains its own intrinsic fallacies, but i respect a lot the fact that it is presented with more intellectual integrity than any electoral campaigns or party platforms or national myths we have over here

[Rob Instigator]

yep. too many Hispanic men think they are white like trump.

Have you been to El Paso TX? 95% mexican-americans, but you cannot tell because 30-40% of them have bought-in to the white is right mentality, and behave with full self-hate to fellow mexican americans.

[Rob Instigator]

actualy, USA Dems play too NICE. they try to be "moral" and "proper" all the while their opponents are hittin below the belt and throwing sand in their eyes.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Rob Instigator

actualy, USA Dems play too NICE. they try to be "moral" and "proper" all the while their opponents are hittin below the belt and throwing sand in their eyes.

democrats are idiots who eat their own. especially if they are men. remember al franken?

a lot of that culture war has played right into trump's hands btw

[Rob Instigator]

In a culture that values being an edgelord instead of being educated, you end up with a micro-penis rapist grifter running thangs.

[_slavo_]

Originally Posted by _slavo_

My dear American friends, make the right choice today.

Well, you didn't.

[tw2113]

not surprised but disappointed.

[Genteel Death 2]

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

i don't agree with your ideology because i've seen it fail, and you might say it's a matter of implementation while i think it contains its own intrinsic fallacies, but i respect a lot the fact that it is presented with more intellectual integrity than any electoral campaigns or party platforms or national myths we have over here

Nothing is ever going to roll out smoothly when implementing a fair system for all, not sure why it should. It’s very likely to be met with violent friction. We've been here before on this forum on a past thread about communism. While I don’t think it’s beneficial for millions of Americans to vote for either Trump or Harris, as a Leninist/ Marxist communist, it should be noted that in terms of capitalist rhetoric, Trump’s populist approach has more appeal to a broader set of settled working class ethnic groups in the States than Kamala Harris’ liberal, mild and patronisingly educated approach. His lies have some relatable hooks. A perfect example of this is his approach to the pandemic, which is not that different to that of revolutionary communists. While a lot of intellectual liberals were going on about staying home and save lives on social media, he understood that a lot of the less well-off working-class folks could not afford to just stay at home and work. Not such an option when you have a family to feed, and working is your only way to survive. He’s obviously a poisonous bag of shit, but he knows how to press all the right buttons with the oppressed.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Genteel Death 2

Nothing is ever going to roll out smoothly when implementing a fair system for all, not sure why it should. It’s very likely to be met with violent friction. We've been here before on this forum on a past thread about communism.

yeah it was not my intention to insist on the differences or "debate" you, i just wanted to express my appreciation for what i saw as the intellectual integrity of your post without agreeing with its contents

and here again you show a rational response to the oppositional part of my post. which again i appreciate

i do not have the same respect for weaksauce "feelings" american style pseudo leftism--the kind practiced by spoiled privileged children who stole the word woke from black folks just to highlight their social media virtue signaling without accomplishing shit or sacrificing anything, and then cry when you disagree with them

(bolsheviks on the other hand have always been fighters)

anyway this relates to the following:

Originally Posted by Genteel Death 2

it should be noted that in terms of capitalist rhetoric, Trump’s populist approach has more appeal to a broader set of settled working class ethnic groups in the States than Kamala Harris’ liberal, mild and patronisingly educated approach. His lies have some relatable hooks. A perfect example of this is his approach to the pandemic, which is not that different to that of revolutionary communists. While a lot of intellectual liberals were going on about staying home and save lives on social media, he understood that a lot of the less well-off working-class folks could not afford to just stay at home and work. Not such an option when you have a family to feed, and working is your only way to survive. He’s obviously a poisonous bag of shit, but he knows how to press all the right buttons with the oppressed.

american "liberals" (not even liberals in the original sense) are idiots, but to me the lesser evil. they at least have "good intentions", even though these often backfire from, as you put it, "a mild and patronisingly educated approach"

whereas trump is a fucking bastard but manipulates the poor extremely well in order to benefit himself

case in point: i have a phone number from a battleground state (i'm not there but sill have the number), and for some reason was getting nonstop trump campaign texts all day. "they think you're garbage!" was a massive button they pushed in the final days. get out the vote, take someone with you, "will you stop her?". kept getting links to townhalls with elon musk. relentless (and infuriating, to me). a play on emotions, cults of personality, nonstop intensity whipping up the crowd into a frenzy

the only texts i got from harris were polite requests for money. super fucking lame

i'll still vote blue no matter who because here we always end up with a binary choice. there are no real third parties much less one that represents me. and while liberals asked people during covid to stay at home, they also were quick to activate unemployment insurance, debt and eviction moratoriums, food banks, and public health systems. both sides sent the support payments (that we're still paying for today via inflation, instead of billing the rich for it) but the fucking asshole wanted his own signature in them. the vanity of the fucking bastard. his signature

anyway, the tyrant arrives to the masses perceived as their savior today, but we know how that will end up tomorrow. after that, maybe it will be the time you get your chance.

i don't know where i'll be by then. maybe buried at sea lol

[The Soup Nazi]

Originally Posted by Severian

Fuck This Shit

Yeah, I'm out.

I already did it with this country and all in all it has worked pretty well so far. Now I've canceled my paid subscriptions to the WaPo and the NYT, and the free subscriptions to Zakaria, Wonkette, etc. And I'm not checking world news anymore - everything leads back to the US anyway. Politics is/are bound to filter with music and art information; I'll have to deal with that somehow.

Also, I'm unsubscribing from this thread. Which I started. Oh, the irony.

[Rob Instigator]

You know, he is never going to leave office, right? Gonna pull an FDR.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Rob Instigator

You know, he is never going to leave office, right? Gonna pull an FDR.

fdr died in office. orange bastardo is gonna eat the blood and organs of young women and pull a baron harkonnen

 

eta:
actually this reminds me of kathy acker's "george bush" (george bush and acker are also dead now). it was prophetic. i'll see if i can find a link

...

not george bush. PRESIDENT bush! hence the 1989 prophecy was fulfilled this century hahahaha

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlATOD_3_ek

enjoy

[Severian]

I can’t say Fuck This Shit enough.

Megafuck this shit in the dick.

Fuck This Shit in every hole from every angle.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Severian

I can’t say Fuck This Shit enough.

Megafuck this shit in the dick.

Fuck This Shit in every hole from every angle.

i know man but we need to toughen up and survive this

it's not to diminish the seriousness of the disaster, but you gotta be stoic to endure, focus on what you can control, and remain aware of what you can't control. i guess a little bit like the drunkard prayer

the hairier the situation, the more unperturbed we need to remain. otherwise we just can't function

we're living in "interesting times" for sure, like the apocryphal chinese curse. but hang in there and do not lose you shit. that's what the adversary wants. do not give it that satisfaction

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by choc e-Claire

I think Harris wins in a close one. But the Democratic party has got to come up with a better way to win elections than just hoping Trump's campaign implodes on itself; eventually the Republicans are going to come up with a far-right candidate that isn't a clown car. And none of this "compromising with the sensible centre" shit.

hey, i have my strong opinions but im not pigheadedly close-minded, so here i'll offer the writing of someone who you might agree with:

--

Dear Reader,

The first thing I have to say is that here at The Nation we feel your pain. We spent Tuesday evening in the office watching the results pour in with our coworkers and contributors. The theory we had was: What good is sitting alone in your room? The practice was more like the ballroom on the Titanic.

I can still remember the chill in my spine in 2016, when James Carville said at 9 pm, when they still hadn’t called Virginia for Clinton, that there might be trouble. Virginia was called late this year too—but, unlike in 2016, the signs were everywhere. As some of us pointed out in the week before the election, Harris had a clear theory of the case: a closing argument about Trump’s unfitness for office, and counting on Republican women to turn out for Harris. And while we all would have preferred that theory to have been proven correct, we also realized that campaigning with the Cheneys was likely to alienate as many potential voters as it attracted.

As Jeet Heer noted on Monday, allowing Trump a clear lane to masquerade as the anti-war candidate was dangerous. Joan Walsh, meanwhile, cautioned that Democrats in Georgia felt more isolated than four years ago, and persuadable voters were harder to find there. In his preelection writing, John Nichols cited Bernie Sanders—and UAW president Shawn Fain—calling on Harris and Walz to give voters a populist option on the left.

Instead, when asked what she would do differently from Biden, Harris replied, “Nothing comes to mind.” The failure to differentiate herself from a deeply unpopular incumbent may have been her biggest mistake. But the conditions that made doing anything else practically unthinkable are the responsibility of the Democratic donor and consultant class that took a messy but hopeful handoff and turned it into a reprise of the failed 2016 campaign. As Heer wrote after the results came in for Trump, we have to hold the Democratic elite responsible for their failures this time around. (At a minimum, writes Zephyr Teachout, Chuck Schumer, one of the principal architects of this failed strategy, should resign.) Before there can be a revival, there really needs to be a reckoning. The question now turns from “Why?” to “Now what?” Might Congress be one line of defense? What does it mean that Trump actually won the popular vote? And, how should we defend ourselves in the new Trump era?

Here at The Nation—as we prepare to enter our 160th year—we promise to keep asking these questions alongside you, and hopefully providing some answers as well. Keep the faith—and keep fighting.

-D.D. Guttenplan
Editor, The Nation

[Rob Instigator]