[pbradley]

Originally Posted by pantophobia

before them was a shop where they sold cheap black engine grease for labor workers and all-night shifters

That's the shit I go for. No fucking around, black-as-your-soul coffee.

I can't go for classy cream bullshit.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Dead-Air

I can't tell you, because I don't actually know. However, I'm pretty sure they likely did offer benefits. As I don't think they were publicly traded, stock options would not likely be a reality. Was there profit sharing? I have no idea, but I think they probably treated their workers well. Certainly better than Starbucks did when they put them all out on the street.

As for your tirade against tipping, I'm sure if you buy coffee or whatever and don't tip out of the generosity of your philosophical self-righteousness, that the server will thank you for your nobility in toppling neo-fuedalism by stiffing them. Yeah, fucking, right.

they likely did? more likely did not-- most small businesses, and i really mean most, offer 0 worker's benefits. i'm talking especially those that have only a handful of employees. notice that a 500-employee company is still considered a "small business", so coffee shops, small restaurants, etc,-- dream on. i've worked in all manner of independet retail establishments and i've never come across such a chimera as "employee benefits". about "probably" etc--

look at this:

Thanks to soaring insurance premiums, many small-business owners say health insurance is a luxury they simply can't afford. [...] Indeed, while 98% of large firms (defined as 200 employees or more) provide health insurance for their workers, only 59% of small firms do. Back in 2000, the figure was much higher with 68% of small businesses offering their employees health benefits. As you might expect, the smallest firms (those with just three to nine employees) struggle the most with affordability and only 47% of them provide any type of coverage.

http://www.smartmoney.com/consumer/i...story=20050921

about treating their employees right, etc -- starfucks has something like 90% employee satisfaction-- unheard of in any industry. you know what the pro-union employees complain about? being sprinkled with hot milk. OHMYFUCKINGAWD!! THEMILKKK!!!! please... most people hate their jobs and here you have a company with 90% job satisfaction.

about tipping-- i tip, and generously, and never less than $2 regardless of the amount of my consumption (say, i buy a beer for a buck fifty, i tip two bucks). having once been a waiter for all of 2 months (wow, a record), my heart goes out to the poor fuckers who have to do a song and dance to asshole customers in order to make a living, so i tip around 25% in restaurants. but personally i would rather pay extra upfront and give all workers a living wage, rather than make them whore their smiles for change. but i guess you can't beat a system of incentives like that if you want good customer service. "be nice, or else..." sounds to me like you'd rather have pet monkeys that you can throw money at, you little prince of the petty-bourgeoisie.

---

hey dont get me wrong. i like small independent well-run establishments too. i hate macdonalds, etc-- but crapping on starbucks just because they are good at what they do is dumb.

[Androol]

Originally Posted by Dead-Air

As for your tirade against tipping, I'm sure if you buy coffee or whatever and don't tip out of the generosity of your philosophical self-righteousness, that the server will thank you for your nobility in toppling neo-fuedalism by stiffing them. Yeah, fucking, right.

there is no way in hell thats stiffing them. me delivering pizzas four three years in the bowels of hell in both dallas and austin and climbing four flights of stairs then the customer asking for extra red pepper etc. then me having to climb the flight all over again then the person even asking for the 50 cents in change let alone not giving a tip. THAT is stiffing someone. i have zero sympathy for 75% of the brats in this world who think they deserve a tip.

[Rob Instigator]

I was the one who had the tirade against tipping the COFFE SHOP PEOPLE

I tip over 20% at restaurants, i tip a dollar every singel time I get a refill at a bar, I tip delivery people, etc.

I do NOT tip a guy who made me a cup of coffee AT A COFFEE SHOP

[_slavo_]

I had an iced latte in Starbucks in Vienna today.

Was good. I was thinking of Thurston while sipping that.

[floatingslowly]

this thread is LAME and one of the main reasons I never post in this forum for obsessives.....

who the fuck cares how the band makes money?

do they owe you people any personal favors?

how often do you clock in at work, only to decide that you would rather just work your shift for the good of all mankind.

fucking hippie shit.

this is not directed at panto for posting this so much as all the *GASP*starbucks*GASP*.

maybe they should start hand making all their CD's and passing them out to the first 5 random people they happen to bump into on the street. then YOU can feel super elite for listening.

[Moshe]

http://www.tinymixtapes.com/Straight...residen-t-Desk


Straight from the Presiden’t Desk: Sonic Youth to Record Exclusive Song for Starbucks; Hell Freezes Over

In a recent exclusive AIM interview with the President of the United States of America, Thurston Moore told the Oval Office that Starbucks will be releasing a new Sonic Youth compilation album with an exclusive song and a tracklist made up of celebrities like Portia de Rossi and Michelle Williams’ favorite Sonic Youth tunes.
Here’s the interview:
GeorgieNhizBush: Yeeeeehawww! Hey, Thurston, how the %^*# have you been?! LOL
apatheticAnDproud38: Hey Georgie! Whut’s ^ foo’? I just mailed u a mix tape <3
GeorgieNhizBush: NMU? Thirsty, The Pentagon and I jest decided to seize the Greenland ice cap and blow it up, so we can keep selling SUV’s and not worry ’bout dem caps meltin’!
apatheticAnDproud38: Aw shit, I love my SUV. It’s got SO MANY CUPHOLDERS!!!
GeorgieNhizBush: Yep. Wana get some joe?? Er some oil?? I sure do luuuuvs oil! $$$
apatheticAnDproud38: Nah dood, I just drank dis new hot-chocolate-mega-mocha-kappa-gamma-frothy-ass-latte from STARBUCKS!!© Oh, speaking of STARBUCKS!!©...
GeorgieNhizBush: ...Uhm, Thirsty, how come ya keep typin up dat copyright thingy-ding when ya say Starbucks??
apatheticAnDproud38: They pay me everytime I do it!
apatheticAnDproud38: ANYWAY! STARBUCKS!!© is gonna have Sonic Youth CDs on the counter with the biscotti and the Dixie Chicks CD real soon!
apatheticAnDproud38: We’re getting a buncha hot babes to pick all the songs from our back catalog for it, and we’re recording an exclusive song for it too, ’cos we know that all our biggest fans are also incidentally STARBUCKS© frequenters!
GeorgieNhizBush: YEEHAW!!! I LUV STARBUCKS! ..Got n e good porn?

[floatingslowly]

I would be infinitely more dismayed to learn that Thurston typed like that than ANY kind of wacky sales promotion a record exec could think up.

[Androol]

Originally Posted by floatingslowly

this thread is LAME and one of the main reasons I never post in this forum for obsessives.....
.

okay

Originally Posted by floatingslowly

this thread is LAME and one of the main reasons I never post in this forum for obsessives.....

who the fuck cares how the band makes money?

do they owe you people any personal favors?

how often do you clock in at work, only to decide that you would rather just work your shift for the good of all mankind.

fucking hippie shit.

this is not directed at panto for posting this so much as all the *GASP*starbucks*GASP*.

maybe they should start hand making all their CD's and passing them out to the first 5 random people they happen to bump into on the street. then YOU can feel super elite for listening.

Indeed.

[demonrail666]

Maybe if SY didn't come accross quite as preachily as they sometimes do, people would feel less inclined to criticise them when they do something like this.

[Androol]

Originally Posted by demonrail666

Maybe if SY didn't come accross quite as preachily as they sometimes do,

huh?!

[Washing Machine]

generally this indie underground, elitist thing is placed upon them, the band themselves seem laid back. This Starbucks thing isn't such a big deal. Is it really any different to them being on Geffen? Someone probebly approched them with the idea, they thought it was kinda fun so went with it. Plus if it gets a few more people listening to SY then great. Theres nothing wrong with making money, as long as you handle having money with dignity.

[Dead-Air]

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

they likely did? more likely did not-- most small businesses, and i really mean most, offer 0 worker's benefits. i'm talking especially those that have only a handful of employees. notice that a 500-employee company is still considered a "small business", so coffee shops, small restaurants, etc,-- dream on. i've worked in all manner of independet retail establishments and i've never come across such a chimera as "employee benefits". about "probably" etc--

look at this:

http://www.smartmoney.com/consumer/i...story=20050921

You are making generalities about all companies, however, and I am speaking from my own experience in the area and with this particular company. Not enough on my part to know for sure, but I think they probably did offer benefits. Keep in mind, they were pretty big, and had to compete with Starbucks for employees. The people I knew who worked there seemed at least as happy as the people I've know who worked at Starbucks. Batdorf & Bronson in Olympia is smaller than Coffee People still, but they offer benefits. Your statistics are nationwide, and I'm talking about a specific, rather large, industry in the NW. Neither of us know for absolute sure though, so it's a pointless argument of conjectures.

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

about treating their employees right, etc -- starfucks has something like 90% employee satisfaction-- unheard of in any industry. you know what the pro-union employees complain about? being sprinkled with hot milk. OHMYFUCKINGAWD!! THEMILKKK!!!! please... most people hate their jobs and here you have a company with 90% job satisfaction.

I never said anything against employee satisfaction at Starbucks. Who cares? My beef with Starbucks was them buying all of the Coffee Peoples and closing them down, which really hurt the original culture of Portland. I'm sure many Starbucks employees are happy, just as most Microsoft employees are happy, and in fact most people who work for the Department of Homeland Security are also happy with their jobs. It says nothing about what a company does to the rest of the world (though I will agree that most small business people who are bastards treat their customers and their employees equally bad.)

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

about tipping-- i tip, and generously, and never less than $2 regardless of the amount of my consumption (say, i buy a beer for a buck fifty, i tip two bucks). having once been a waiter for all of 2 months (wow, a record), my heart goes out to the poor fuckers who have to do a song and dance to asshole customers in order to make a living, so i tip around 25% in restaurants. but personally i would rather pay extra upfront and give all workers a living wage, rather than make them whore their smiles for change. but i guess you can't beat a system of incentives like that if you want good customer service. "be nice, or else..." sounds to me like you'd rather have pet monkeys that you can throw money at, you little prince of the petty-bourgeoisie.

Why does it sound to you that way? I'm pleased to hear that you actually tip people, because your rhetoric before read like you were making excuses for why you don't. Instead it seems you were just making false assumptions about me that I can't see anything I posted that justifies. All I said was something about throwing money in a tip jar, and you somehow read into it that I want the people handing me my tea to say "Massa" and flash me their tits. Since you do essentially the same thing I do, I can't see why you think that. I've probably worked in more service industry jobs than you have, so trust me, I tip, because I know how much it sucks to have to do that type of stuff, and for little other reason. True, if somebody is being an asshole to me, I probably wouldn't give them any extra money, but who would? I too hate the system and would rather people just got it up front, but while people are stuck in it, I'm one of the people who believes in supporting workers rather than blaming the victim. Statistically, tips seem to be higher from people with less money, which is another sign of how fucked up it all is.

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

hey dont get me wrong. i like small independent well-run establishments too. i hate macdonalds, etc-- but crapping on starbucks just because they are good at what they do is dumb.

This I just don't get. You go on about why this big corp is so wonderful and then you disclaim that you're actually a regular guy who doesn't like corps either. Mind, I don't doubt they do some good - witness the Sonic Youth disc in question, which I don't have any problem with at all (I'm sure it will expose the band to all sorts of people.) My issue with Starbucks has nothing to do with being "good" however, I'm pissed that they bought something that was unique to my town, just to have it removed from their presence. So now Portland looks just a little more like everytown USA where you see a Starbucks, then a McDonalds, then a Target, then an Applebees, and then you go a few feet and it all starts over again. I don't think creating more of that is "good" at all.

[matt g]

my only issue with this starbucks thing is not that it's necessarily starbucks, or any notion of "selling out" to a mega corporation, that's all a bunch of high school-esque altruistic fairy-tale nonsense. whatever. any band that goes beyond playing music for their own edification is selling something, right? you make a cd, you have intention of selling or promoting your music, it becomes a product. this goes for any art medium. like i said, whatever. pimpin' ain't easy.
my issue with the sonic starbux is that it's just quite the trend in the music industry of late to offer superior product to one retailer and leave everybody else out in the cold.
examples:
the new smashing pumpkins (target,bestbuy & itunes have superior product to indie retailers)
that new Darfur Lennon tribute benefit shit (itunes has 11 more tracks than the physical cd) (& yes it's a benefit, but there was a lot of pressure from retail coalitions for stores to buy in big before it was announced that itunes had superior product)
fuckin Tesla's new cd-- best buy had a bonus disc exclusive to them.

so why do i not feel right about sonic starbux? it's not specifically them, it's just the trend to favor one retailer over another. eventually, people are gonna want to get up from their computers and go out to an actual store and experince live human contact. the record companies have been trying to fuck over the general public for years, that's no suprise, but they're also trying to fuck over the mom & pop record stores, the independent chain record stores and eventually, because the record companies are just starting to realize that the overhead cost of online business is cheaper than actually making a physical product, the big box stores. they'll still want to charge you a 18.98 or 13.97 list price for a fucking download that they have all that DRM shit attached to & you won't really own it anyway. it's not a level playing field anymore & i don't think artists see this aspect of it.

what kind of record stores were sonic youth records to be found in while they were "struggling" back in the 80's.... where can you find the SYR series, Target? Wal_mart? Starbucks? or the actual record store? who takes chances on upcoming artists of any genre? well, yeah, i could go on, but i gotta mow the lawn, yo. i know record stores are shit, most of 'em. and most of them have shitty attitude enriched employees who could care less. but i'd rather deal with that than the fucking morons at target-mart-buy-tunes who don't know nuthin bout nothin i care about.

i will be buying my sonic starbux anyway.

[Moshe]

OK, back to the subject:

http://www.digitalmusicnews.com/stories/062407starbucks


Starbucks and Universal Music Group are now priming a release from Sonic Youth, according to information confirmed over the weekend. News of the upcoming project first emerged during an interview between Sonic Youth frontman Thurston Moore and Pitchfork. A media representative for Starbucks subsequently agreed to discuss the project with Digital Music News, and outlined specifics related to release date, track listing, and collaborating artists.

The release, a limited-edition compilation of Sonic Youth covers by well-known contributors, is expected in early 2008. It will be jointly released by both Starbucks Entertainment and Universal Special Markets, and will not be positioned under the freshly-launched Hear Music label, according to the representative. "This is not a Hear Music release," the representative underscored. But the album will be structured like "other joint venture releases," including the highly successful project involving Ray Charles, Concord Music Group (now a partner in Hear Music), and a number of big-name collaborators.

Other details were also disclosed. The Sonic Youth album will be titled Hits Are For Squares, and will specifically feature covers by Eddie Vedder, David Cross, Chloe Sevigny, Dave Eggers and Michelle Williams. In terms of product positioning, the release will only be available at Starbucks in US-based major markets Boston, Chicago, Philadelphia, San Francisco, Seattle, Los Angeles, New York, and Washington, DC. Those outside of those markets can purchase the album at hearmusic.com.

[Everyneurotic]

just pouring salt in the wounds.

fuck sonic youth!!!!

they suck!!!!!!



--
covers album? sure, i'm going to pay to hear actors sing sonic youth songs.

[Rob Instigator]

so it won't be in HOUSTON? The 4th largest fucking city in the US of A?

what a fucking load. I get so sick o fuckers passing us by. There are over 5 million people in the Houston metrolpolitan area, and around 40 starbucks.

Boston, Chicago, Philadelphia, San Francisco, Seattle, Los Angeles, New York, and Washington, DC

philadelphia? BOSTON?????

fuck this shit. I officialy flip-flop.
may this endeavor burn to the ground.

[GrungeMonkey]

So its a cover album?

I'm confused.

[Rob Instigator]

me too. I doubt it is a cover album. the press release probably got it wrong.
I hope it is just a compilation with people choosing their faves.