[Glice]

Originally Posted by Rob Instigator

Of course Glice. it is not only males that get that way, but go to a comic book convention. mostly obsessed males. Go to a vinyl record convention. Mostly obsessed males. Same for punk rock shows, star trek, whatever.
Sure there are women equally if not more obsessed and fangirl like the fanboys, but the difference in ratio cannot be due to only sexism.

It is not sexism that the fangeeks of Sex & The City are mainly women . That is not sexist against men.

I've been to plenty of shows which were mostly women. And, frankly, anyone who likes Sex in the City is a waste of flesh. Is S&TC the same as music culture in general though? Or is it just one instance of abortion-qua-entertainment?

[knox]

And yes it is. I've seen lots of idiotic men who secretly watch Sex and the City and Glee and confess it to me and not their male peers.

And I know who Glice is talking about (I think) and YES she would own all of you in terms of music.

[Rob Instigator]

the vast difference in ratio of males to females on this forum alone is partly to blame for why the ladies get mobbed the moment they announce they are ladies. You know how hard it is to find a woman that actually loves sonic youth? As opposed to tolerating it, or even hating it?

whether it is societal lessons or our own internal make-up, more women than men seem to be (critical words there) irritated by the type of squalor sound that is Sonic Youth's stock in trade. More men than women seem to find this sound appealing.

[Rob Instigator]

Originally Posted by knox

I understand. And that's why they're so willing to protect it - if women can do it then why would women be impressed with my amazing solo skills?

But I thought that was for 16 year old boys. Just like men can't go around saying they love Sade without being made fun of.

Well, I don't wanna perpetuate this whole men play guitar women wanna be groupies thing, do you? I'd like things to be different.

So I guess what you're saying is that you're resigned and you don't care if it remains this way forever.

But a lot of women took a lot of shit to change things and managed to do it, and I don't want girls in the future having it as hard as I did, so why should I just resign and accept it? why should you?

the "protection" is a defense mechanism to maintain a good ol boys club. It SUX. PJ Harvey alone can outrock most men, and there are bound to be hundreds of thousands of women out there ready to rip it up.

I too would like for it to be different. I did not say I was resigned to it, nor that i accepted it. I just stated what IS. It is up to us to change it.

[knox]

Originally Posted by Rob Instigator

the vast difference in ratio of males to females on this forum alone is partly to blame for why the ladies get mobbed the moment they announce they are ladies. You know how hard it is to find a woman that actually loves sonic youth? As opposed to tolerating it, or even hating it?

I don't know in your world Rob but in my world that's not hard at all.
Lots of women love SY, more so than a lot of bands, especially because Kim Gordon's songs and how they address women issues.

[nicfit]

Originally Posted by knox

Just like men can't go around saying they love Sade without being made fun of.

I'd never make fun of Steve Shelley.
That said, I can't contribute to this thread coz I jumped in too late and there's so much to read.

[Rob Instigator]

Originally Posted by Glice

I've been to plenty of shows which were mostly women. And, frankly, anyone who likes Sex in the City is a waste of flesh. Is S&TC the same as music culture in general though? Or is it just one instance of abortion-qua-entertainment?

Maybe not the same.

Can you elaborate as to the shows where the ladies outnumbered the fellas?

I have been to a few of those but they were always pop starlets.

at a show like Tony bennet the ratio is 50/50

at a show like sonic youth it is usually more 60/40 male/female

at a fucking Slayer show? 95% male.

is that sexist? No. Slayer does not appeal to as many women as they do men.

[Glice]

Originally Posted by knox

And yes it is. I've seen lots of idiotic men who secretly watch Sex and the City and Glee and confess it to me and not their male peers.

And I know who Glice is talking about (I think) and YES she would own all of you in terms of music.

Yeah, definitely the same person.

I know loads of women who like SY. More than I do men, I think. I know plenty of people who think they're good, but most of the actual fans I know are women. Kim's a huge deal for a lot of people. I know quite a few people who like SY just on the principle that Kim's in them, without particularly liking their records.

This might seem a bit like I'm contradicting you (Rob) for the sake of it, but I seriously don't think that the 'blokes are more likely to be geeks' argument applies here. Certainly, if this was the board for Dragonforce...

[Rob Instigator]

Originally Posted by knox

I don't know in your world Rob but in my world that's not hard at all.
Lots of women love SY, more so than a lot of bands, especially because Kim Gordon's songs and how they address women issues.

I know. You have said as much before, but I live in the USA. It seems different here, maybe, as you stated, because of inherent societal sexism. I blame the marketing and advertyising media. they teach our youth what a "girl" likes and what a "boy" likes, and woe to the people that buck their strict "rules!"

you know?

I hate them fuckers.

[Rob Instigator]

but to be honest, the vast majority of male posters here never spout sexist shit or mysoginist shit. the males get painted with a big brush because of the actions of a few, which happen to draw the most attention.

[knox]

I went to a Slayer show. I went to a lot of shitty metal shows. In fact, I even went to a Manowar concert, do you know what Manowar is?

Yeah. There were 40% women and 60% men I think. The women were mostly being ignored while their boyfriends jumped around in excitement. One of my friends was a metal fan, she always complained about how women were treated in that "community", as if they can't be fans, only girlfriends.

But yeah, the Manowar show. Men in tight leather outfits shouting about the power of men and showing off muscles. So, of course I wasn't too crazy about it, homo-eroticism+war glorification.

And then they pretended to be upset when that bald guy from Judas Priest came out.

So I guess it wouldn't be because women cannot tolerate and are not interested in those sounds - more like there's some in-your-face sexism in metal, especially.

I've been to many gigs in which women outnumbered men - PJ Harvey was one of them. But I think Sigur Ros was one of them as well, and everytime I've seen SY women were at least 40%.

[knox]

Originally Posted by Rob Instigator

but to be honest, the vast majority of male posters here never spout sexist shit or mysoginist shit. the males get painted with a big brush because of the actions of a few, which happen to draw the most attention.

No, come on. You don't need to go out and start saying horrible things to create an unfriendly environment. But it did happen many times.

But I wouldn't go there if I were you - since you were probably the main poster of shit that wasn't very welcoming for women.

[knox]

Once again, I've been getting private messages from women on the forum who agree with me and say they are put off by the sexism on this board.

I guess they don't wanna read the shit that I have to read posted at me, but I invite them to please state those thoughts in public at least to make me look like less of a lunatic and make a better point.

I cannot do it for everyone else alone all the time.

[DeadDiscoDildo]

This thread is gay.

[artsygrrl]

Originally Posted by knox

Once again, I've been getting private messages from women on the forum who agree with me and say they are put off by the sexism on this board.

I guess they don't wanna read the shit that I have to read posted at me, but I invite them to please state those thoughts in public at least to make me look like less of a lunatic and make a better point.

I cannot do it for everyone else alone all the time.

I'm one that pm'd her. knox has a valid point. She's right on for calling you out regarding the sexist attitudes.
But I did let her know that for the most part she fights alone because it seems as tho she chooses to. Now I realize that's hopefully not the case.

[ann ashtray]

Women (generally speaking) tend to dig men that have succeeded at something. Artsy girls tend to dig boys in bands, etc (esp. if whatever given band is actually playing gigs). I find that (seemingly/generally...) artsy boys are intimidated by girls in bands..at least when it comes to actually approaching them in some sort of romantic way.

I also find that if women (again...generally speaking) can't find a boy whose managed to succeed at something, settling for someone that at least offers the allure of success can be satisfactory. ..like some jackass that thinks he's hot shit because he drives a '96 Mustang or has parents willing to let him borrow the Mercedes/wears expensive clothes his parents/other girlfriends buy him.

Basically, almost everyone is a fucking idiot.

There are DRASTIC differences between the sexes that go far beyond genitalia. And even though I see this SLOWLY changing over time, these differences are indeed still there and likely always be on some level.

Whenever I encounter a woman with a strong "hunter/gatherer" mentality (which is often), it seems to be more out of necessity than anything else.

That said, men do seem to be becoming lazier than what we used to be....again, again...generally speaking.

And as a final side note, I love Rob's post. He seems to have some serious ability to observe what is there, as opposed to what he wants to be there.

[knox]

Yeah, I like people who have succeeded at something. Mostly not being a total idiot, it seems to be an achievement in this world we live in.

[Rob Instigator]

People's is up late.
I wish people would just rock

[artsygrrl]

My head hurts.

[knox]

we're too old for rock.